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On 6/11/2019 8:56 AM, Hernan Wilkinson wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAJAbP8jKb-+QB6TvBX0UeFEu06XXgX2eNmrK+xo0Lp7HFws99w@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">A few comments:
<div>1) super pvt* it is not allowed because "private" parts of
a class are only visible to its instances, at least that it is
how c++/java and the like treat private stuff (methods, vars,
etc). So in Java you can not do super.prvt*(). </div>
<div>The behavior you are proposing Phil would be like
"protected" in those languages. In fact, we could say that
inst. vars. in Smalltalk are protected in the c++/java
parlance.</div>
<div>So, my guess is that the current restriction on super pvt*
came from that understanding "private".</div>
<div>Having said that, I see no problem to change that
restriction and treat pvt* messages as they were protected
although it will be confusing to explain when compared to
other languages. I think it would be better in that case to
have prt* (protected) instead of pvt* but that would generate
a migration problem...</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Mhh. Difficult decision. We could keep the 'pvt' prefix, but in
methods that handle them, we could add comments stating that it is
like what c++/java calls "protected". The error could be "Protected
messages may only be sent to self" (protected instead of private).<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAJAbP8jKb-+QB6TvBX0UeFEu06XXgX2eNmrK+xo0Lp7HFws99w@mail.gmail.com"
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<div dir="ltr">
<div>2) About treating methods in private categories as private
methods, I think it is not a good idea because the category of
a method can change from a "public" category to a "private"
one and valid message send would become invalid which is
impossible to check in a dynamic env. as Smalltalk. Using pvt
in the beginning of the message name solves that problem. </div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Yes. What I suggest is to start adding the pvt prefix to existing
methods we want to be private. For example, those in 'private*'
categories and selectors starting with 'private'.<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAJAbP8jKb-+QB6TvBX0UeFEu06XXgX2eNmrK+xo0Lp7HFws99w@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>(BTW, this made me realize that the rename message does not
handle this situation correctly, I mean when renaming a public
to a private selector).</div>
</div>
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<br>
Cool. Hope you'll fix it then :)<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAJAbP8jKb-+QB6TvBX0UeFEu06XXgX2eNmrK+xo0Lp7HFws99w@mail.gmail.com"
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<div><br>
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<div>Cheers</div>
<div>Hernan.</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Jun 11, 2019 at 3:05
AM Phil B via Cuis-dev <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:cuis-dev@lists.cuis.st">cuis-dev@lists.cuis.st</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
padding-left: 1ex;">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">Juan,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>After reading Luciano's response I realized I
probably completely misunderstood what you were saying
here...</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Jun 10, 2019 at
6:24 PM Juan Vuletich <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:juan@jvuletich.org" target="_blank">juan@jvuletich.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
padding-left: 1ex;">BTW, we'd really make methods such
as #setCollection:, <br>
#setNumerator:denominator:, actually all methods set*,
all methods <br>
private* and all methods in a 'private*' category
actually private... <br>
For example the comment at #privateSetX:setY: looks so
silly.<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Are you proposing that we extend the visibility to
class-side as well and make these methods #pvt* or
treating members of the 'private' category[1] as if they
were #pvt*? I'm still not feeling like I completely
understand what you're suggesting...</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Thanks,</div>
<div>Phil</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>[1] If it's the latter, keep in mind from my previous
response that there are often multiple private*
categories in other people's code... would we handle
those (based on a private prefix?) or simply say only
'private' is private?</div>
</div>
</div>
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</blockquote>
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<div><span style="font-family:
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border-collapse: collapse;"><strong><span
style="font-size: 8pt;"><span><span
style="font-size: small;"><font
size="2"><span
style="font-weight: normal;"><span
style="font-weight: bold;">Hernán
Wilkinson</span><br>
Agile Software Development,
Teaching & Coaching</span></font></span></span></span></strong></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:
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<br>
Cheers,<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Juan Vuletich
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.cuis-smalltalk.org">www.cuis-smalltalk.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://github.com/Cuis-Smalltalk/Cuis-Smalltalk-Dev">https://github.com/Cuis-Smalltalk/Cuis-Smalltalk-Dev</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://github.com/jvuletich">https://github.com/jvuletich</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/juan-vuletich-75611b3">https://www.linkedin.com/in/juan-vuletich-75611b3</a>
@JuanVuletich</pre>
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