<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
<title></title>
</head>
<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
Hi Maximo.<br>
<br>
On 7/29/2019 1:02 PM, Máximo Prieto wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAFcqOQG7r=Uryt3C+Wt53FWha=zh4gO9KOA3XDF5fHeXN218zA@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Hi, Juan. I didn't know the story but I suspected
it. It never made sense to me to have different standards for
fileOuts.</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Well, I agree, but it is broader than just fileOuts. To me it
doesn't make sense to have different line ending conventions at all.<br>
<br>
In the old days, OSes had various line ending conventions:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newline">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newline</a> . When Smalltalk-80 was built
it made perfect sense to choose cr as the line end. Later MacOS also
chose it. Unix had already chosen lf. CP/M and later DOS and
Windows, chose crLf. <br>
<br>
Much later, in 2001, Mac OS X started using lf on Mac. After that
moment, to keep using cr is asking for problems on _any_ platform.
Another thing that happened is that Windows programs started to
handle lf reasonably. Last year, Microsoft finally fixed Notepad:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/05/08/windows_notepad_unix_linux_macos">https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/05/08/windows_notepad_unix_linux_macos</a>
.<br>
<br>
As an argument against automatic line ending conversions, also
consider that it requires the program to know whether a file (or
network stream) is text or not, as it would break any executable or
jpg, etc. It is better not to do it, and stick to _some_ convention.
On the convention of using lf for code stored in GitHub, see
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://adaptivepatchwork.com/2012/03/01/mind-the-end-of-your-line">https://adaptivepatchwork.com/2012/03/01/mind-the-end-of-your-line</a> .
Also take into account that GitHub considers changing the line
ending of a file as a diff.<br>
<br>
I think lf is the most reasonable convention today, and I made Cuis
use it many years ago, before Cuis had wide adoption, so it was a
hindrance for few people.<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAFcqOQG7r=Uryt3C+Wt53FWha=zh4gO9KOA3XDF5fHeXN218zA@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Quoting you: "Besides, isn't it time for Pharo to drop cr
as the line ending?" Stop quoting. How do we make that
happens?</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
I'd suggest:<br>
1) be an active member of the Pharo community<br>
2) try to convince others<br>
3) be ready to lead the technical effort to make it happen<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAFcqOQG7r=Uryt3C+Wt53FWha=zh4gO9KOA3XDF5fHeXN218zA@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">El lun., 29 jul. 2019 a las
12:49, Juan Vuletich via Cuis-dev (<<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:cuis-dev@lists.cuis.st">cuis-dev@lists.cuis.st</a>>)
escribió:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px
0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
padding-left: 1ex;">
<div bgcolor="#ffffff"> On 7/26/2019 6:24 PM, Gastón Caruso
via Cuis-dev wrote:
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Hi all! With Facu we've done a changeset to
replace all the new line characters used by Pharo by the
ones Cuis uses when we perform a File in.
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Before:</div>
<div>
<div>...<br>
</div>
</div>
<div>After:</div>
<div>
<div>...<br>
</div>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Let us know what do you think!</div>
</div>
<div>Cheers!</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Hi Folks,<br>
<br>
In general, I don't like tools modifying files without me
asking. In Cuis lf, cr, and crLf are shown in a clearly
distinct way. If the user wants to convert a file, the user
can select it in the File List, and do cmd-a (select all)
shift-cmd-u (convert to Cuis line ending) and cmd-s (save).
I think it is convenient enough, and there's no risk the
user not knowing the file is being modified.<br>
<br>
Besides, isn't it time for Pharo to drop cr as the line
ending? The ony mainstream platform using it was MacOS
something like 20 years ago...<br>
<br>
<pre class="gmail-m_4009133986647026903moz-signature" cols="72">--
Juan Vuletich
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="gmail-m_4009133986647026903moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.cuis-smalltalk.org" target="_blank">www.cuis-smalltalk.org</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="gmail-m_4009133986647026903moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://github.com/Cuis-Smalltalk/Cuis-Smalltalk-Dev" target="_blank">https://github.com/Cuis-Smalltalk/Cuis-Smalltalk-Dev</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="gmail-m_4009133986647026903moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://github.com/jvuletich" target="_blank">https://github.com/jvuletich</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="gmail-m_4009133986647026903moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/juan-vuletich-75611b3" target="_blank">https://www.linkedin.com/in/juan-vuletich-75611b3</a>
@JuanVuletich</pre>
</div>
-- <br>
Cuis-dev mailing list<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:Cuis-dev@lists.cuis.st"
target="_blank">Cuis-dev@lists.cuis.st</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://lists.cuis.st/mailman/listinfo/cuis-dev"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://lists.cuis.st/mailman/listinfo/cuis-dev</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Juan Vuletich
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.cuis-smalltalk.org">www.cuis-smalltalk.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://github.com/Cuis-Smalltalk/Cuis-Smalltalk-Dev">https://github.com/Cuis-Smalltalk/Cuis-Smalltalk-Dev</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://github.com/jvuletich">https://github.com/jvuletich</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/juan-vuletich-75611b3">https://www.linkedin.com/in/juan-vuletich-75611b3</a>
@JuanVuletich</pre>
</body>
</html>